Most of the opposition to these roles comes from “junior” doctors, who feel threatened. Consultants and hospital administrators typically find PAs very helpful.
throwawayhaematuric on
This is NOT a staffing row, this is a Patient Safety issue!
The massive problem here is that we have a new group of staff who are meant to assist doctors who are instead acting outside their competence.
1. There are many cases of them requesting ionising radiation, which is knowingly against the law, and prescribing medication which is also against their current scope of practice. These are illegal and if a nursing associate did this, they’d be struck off. There have also been physician associates assessing cases of child suspected physical abuse – which all resident doctors know that should be done by either almost fully qualified Paediatricians, or Paediatric consultants.
2. Patients often do not know if they’re seeing a doctor or a physician associate, many PAs tend to obfuscate their role to patients and even staff at times (Despite being told that they must use their full title). Many patients are shocked that when they think they’re speaking to a GP, they’re actually speaking to a PA.
3. They feel as though they are able to act in the capacity as resident/registrar level doctors despite only having done a 2 year Masters course, compared to an average of 5 yr med school, 2 year foundation, and then at least 2/3 years beyond that of practice. You don’t know, what you don’t know – hence resulting in preventable medical errors which have already resulted in the deaths of patients.
4. These guys are meant to be assisting doctors, and have only had a 2 year Masters; they cannot be equivalent to a first year foundation doctor who has spent 5 years in medical school from day one.
5. Physician associates far outearn resident doctors, why is the NHS paying assistants more than doctors? Foundation Year 1 doctors earn around £32k whilst physician associates start on Band 7 (£46k)!
So you have a barely trained, Associate profession being paid more than their supervisors. The current crop have already been acting outwith their competence. This dangerous experiment must end. Calling a spade, a spade; they are quacks plain and simple.
I saw a nurse practitioner a few months ago at a out of hours “gp” service, she examined me, told me that what I thought my symptoms and my problems were were in fact wrong and sent me away with a “treatment”. Two days later still in agony I went to my gp who correctly diagnosed the problem within seconds. Nurse practitioners are charlatans! **Do not** be fobbed off if you get given one at an appointment, demand to see a doctor, you’ll thank me later.
FearlessPressure3 on
The linked case of Emily Chesterton in this article is astounding. I know that calf pain, a swollen calf and shortness of breath is a medical emergency, but apparently this PA didn’t and she died!? Got to wonder what on earth they’re even being taught in that two year course if something as obvious as a blood clot is missed.
flyanotherday on
Nick Triggle, the author of this piece, is a notoriously biased reporter.
5 Comments
Most of the opposition to these roles comes from “junior” doctors, who feel threatened. Consultants and hospital administrators typically find PAs very helpful.
This is NOT a staffing row, this is a Patient Safety issue!
The massive problem here is that we have a new group of staff who are meant to assist doctors who are instead acting outside their competence.
1. There are many cases of them requesting ionising radiation, which is knowingly against the law, and prescribing medication which is also against their current scope of practice. These are illegal and if a nursing associate did this, they’d be struck off. There have also been physician associates assessing cases of child suspected physical abuse – which all resident doctors know that should be done by either almost fully qualified Paediatricians, or Paediatric consultants.
2. Patients often do not know if they’re seeing a doctor or a physician associate, many PAs tend to obfuscate their role to patients and even staff at times (Despite being told that they must use their full title). Many patients are shocked that when they think they’re speaking to a GP, they’re actually speaking to a PA.
3. They feel as though they are able to act in the capacity as resident/registrar level doctors despite only having done a 2 year Masters course, compared to an average of 5 yr med school, 2 year foundation, and then at least 2/3 years beyond that of practice. You don’t know, what you don’t know – hence resulting in preventable medical errors which have already resulted in the deaths of patients.
4. These guys are meant to be assisting doctors, and have only had a 2 year Masters; they cannot be equivalent to a first year foundation doctor who has spent 5 years in medical school from day one.
5. Physician associates far outearn resident doctors, why is the NHS paying assistants more than doctors? Foundation Year 1 doctors earn around £32k whilst physician associates start on Band 7 (£46k)!
So you have a barely trained, Associate profession being paid more than their supervisors. The current crop have already been acting outwith their competence. This dangerous experiment must end. Calling a spade, a spade; they are quacks plain and simple.
Ionising radiation and prescribing – https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/01/27/nhs-doctors-allege-patient-harm-near-misses-pa-training/
Assessing physical abuse – https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/09/30/alder-hey-childrens-hospital-liverpool-physician-associate/
Physician associates medical errors preventable deaths – https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-manchester-66211103
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-manchester-66168798
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/czxvww97pleo
Faculty of Physician Associates further amplify the messaging that the work at the level of a doctor – https://www.fparcp.co.uk/file/media/652d35a68d9a6_FPA_Physician_Associate_Titles_and_Introductions_Guidance_FINAL_5_10_23.pdf
Physician associates pay scale – https://uk.indeed.com/career-advice/pay-salary/how-much-does-physician-associate-make
Foundation doctor pay scale – https://www.bma.org.uk/pay-and-contracts/pay/resident-doctors-pay-scales/pay-scales-for-resident-doctors-in-england
I saw a nurse practitioner a few months ago at a out of hours “gp” service, she examined me, told me that what I thought my symptoms and my problems were were in fact wrong and sent me away with a “treatment”. Two days later still in agony I went to my gp who correctly diagnosed the problem within seconds. Nurse practitioners are charlatans! **Do not** be fobbed off if you get given one at an appointment, demand to see a doctor, you’ll thank me later.
The linked case of Emily Chesterton in this article is astounding. I know that calf pain, a swollen calf and shortness of breath is a medical emergency, but apparently this PA didn’t and she died!? Got to wonder what on earth they’re even being taught in that two year course if something as obvious as a blood clot is missed.
Nick Triggle, the author of this piece, is a notoriously biased reporter.